Double changer idea

[Dave-M]

Hi Mac:
The raising end can also be lowered with the conventional pull-release method. This will give the F# to A overriding raises that I like to have on strings 3 and 6, with the multiple G's on another lever at the lowering end. I like the built-in keyless tuner with no need for rollers , and the simple one-piece fingers.

The lower tuning "outrigger" section of the finger could be attached with screws, allowing fabrication of the finger from narrow bar stock instead of more expensive plate.

The outrigger could be made from the scrap generated where the finger is reduced in size.

[richard37066]

Mike -

Thanks for the references. I've seen the David Jackson one before. Both, however, have too much "monkey-motion" for my tastes. The very short radius pivot will be the modification that I mentioned in another post as opposed to a strict "knife edge" configuration in the changer that I'm working on.

There are only TWO moving parts. No rivets. No bearings. No "monkey-motion". It's a study in simplicity by Gene Fields. If one examines it closely, then it becomes obvious that it can be used in an all-pull configuration with just a smidgen of modification.

http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopi ... gers+hooey

Mac's idea is really neat if he can sort out the mechanics regarding bellcranks, rods etc.. He's undoubtedly realized that a simple design is not so simple if the rest of the mechanics are a nightmare. I trust his abilities. All will be well.

Richard

[Allan]

There seems to be some concern about the screw end moving over the string holder on the 'lower' changer here so I did a 'quick and dirty' drawing to see.
Here it is if anyone is interested...

Macanim.gif (20.96 KiB) Viewed 1864 times

There is some movement but as Mac, himself, has said in the past, hard anodizing works wonders on aluminum. Together with a rounded off screw tip this could be a VERY interesting system.
Nice one Mac...
The rotation angle I used on the drawing was seven degrees at the string holder with the actuator rotated to suit.....

[Bent]

How about a 3/8" OD ball bearing on the tip of the screw?

[Farmer]

Sounds like a good one Bent...............Mike

Richard, On the Feilds design, I see where you are coming from. The most difficult thing I can see is keeping them where you want them. The only reason I refured those designs, was to see if they would help with your design......Mike

[mac639]

Bent... How would you propose to fit a bearing on the end of that screw?
I had thought some of something like that but it'd be a lot of extra work. I thought also of a small ball trapped in the end of a small threaded tube with a spring inside to hold it against the finger, and screw the tuning screw into the top end, but I really don't think it's all that necessary to go to those lengths do you?

On other subjects: I still haven't given up by a long shot on the changer sort of like the PS210 guitar. Stuff is still in a box...and I'll get back to it one of these days....and SOLVE the mechanical problems I had.

Today a busy day, raining like blazes here all day and guess what, my sump pump in the basement sprung a big leak in the outlet pipe and spread water all over the basement...soaked carpets, wet my expensive wood....CRAP!!

Also tonight a guy is coming here to relieve me of all my old guitar treasures, about 25-30 acoustic and electric guitars, banjos, ukes, etc. Put them on Kijiji last night and had people emailing me non stop all night!

Fun day!!

[Bent]

Mac, it would be tricky for sure. You'd need a small 1/8" "axle" protruding from it to go into the 1/8" ID in the bearing. I am visualizing something like the fork of a turnbuckle to hold thew bearing and axle. The female threaded end screws into the bolt. Talk about lots of extra work... I spent better part of the day trying to make a changer retrofit operate smoothly. After about 8 hours, I am almost there. Sorry to hear about your bad sump pump... But man wer eyou lucky with all those instruments! Hope they fetched a nice price for you!

[richard37066]

Mike -

In the original instrument, there are a couple of brackets which support the back of the fingers. Absolute necessity or things fall all over the floor. My thanks for your assist. It's not readily seen but, when everything is in place, the combination of string tension and a lower return spring hold things in place.

Mac and Bent -

How about taking a stainless steel ball bearing, drilling a blind tapped hole, screw the screw into the hole and then silver soldering the thing. Quench it immediately and it's Rockwell 11,000. (LOL) Would have to do it in an assembled state but what's to break or wear out?

Richard

[Gary Patterson]

I love this idea. However, I, too, had concerns about the friction of the tuning screw against the lowering finger. Shubb capo has two solutions, one shown here. Their "deluxe" model uses a small roller in place of the nylon tip.

[LushPyle]

I have a Sierra Session keyless guitar and the tuning screws do move along the tuner shaft as you tune the string. They milled a "valley" in the tuner and it gets packed with grease. I recently tore the guitar down and cleaned it and I can say there was little wear on the tuners after over 15 years. Of course the only time the screw moves along the tuner is when you are tuning that string and not every single time the string is lowered and returned to pitch. Aside from any wear concerns I also wonder if there might be some mechanical noise generated by this motion of the screw sliding along the lower finger? I obviously don't know but if so I still think there will be a way around the problem. I posted a drawing (see page 3) showing "pivots" and in case this was not clear enough here is a picture of the tuner from Ed Packard's "The Beast" guitar that has pivots similar to what I was imagining for this application. I may just be worrying about nothing as it could very well work perfectly as is.