keyless guitar- any more ideas for lowering at this end?

[Dave-M]

Mac:

Regarding scraping for your original adjusting screw, how about drilling a small nylon ball half way through to fit the end of the screw.

Drill a hole in the end of the screw and insert a tiny nylon rod.

Kind of fiddly, but a small claw like what holds gems in rings could hold a ball-bearing.

Alternatively, just round the end of the screw on the grinder.

Glue a rub-strip of nylon, or whatever, on the small rotating finger.

Make the smaller rotating part of stainless ... who cares if it rubs!

Use my idea of 2-piece finger ... no rubbing, one axel, raise or lower!

[mac639]

Dave...is something like this what you had in mind? Funny I never thought of something as simple as this It'd probably work if you get stops etc. in the right places
Thanks a bunch!

[Dave-M]

If you have Winnie Winston's book "Pedal Steel Guitar" where he looks like a kid playing, go to page 112, bottom picture.

In your diagram the bottom pin is replaced by 2 stops, one for raise and the other for lower.
I will try to get a pic for you.
**

OK, pic is below ... make bottom piece thicker so rod can go through. Some kind of dovetail joint! Adjust pull locations to avoid stops. Probably a prototype is necessary to work out the kinks. Someone else in this forum has used this kind of finger. I think they used angle to accomodate the rod going through.

[Dave-M]

[mac639]

Yeah... I'm familiar with that kind of setup. Only trouble in my case is that I've got to be able to "tune" the string as well as raising or lowering it. Thanks anyway, but I may have to think of some other scheme. Normally I build double changer guitars but with the normal keyhead. I've built maybe 14 or 15 like that. This guitar is for me, with the Zane King E6/9 tuning. It's got 28 pulls all together, and a cabinet I've already got made is only long enough for a keyless. Think I'm going to abandon the whole scenario and do a regular all pull changer with 3 raises and 3 lowers, and keep my keyless tail end just to get the strings to pitch. Maybe later I'll think some more on this plan.
Thanks so much for your input.....and wishing you a Merry Christmas and all the best for 2013 from Carleton Place.
Mac

[Dave-M]

Oops, forgot about the tuning aspect! Will think more about it.

**

Get raise, lower, and tuning with this mod to your original idea, Mac.

[mac639]

By heck your head's workin' good today! I'll have to think on this, maybe it's a clever solution after all.
I'll keep you posted....and thanks again
Mac

[Dave-M]

Bump re edits to previous post ...

[mac639]

Dave.... I've gone back to my original idea pretty much. I changed the shape of the lever arm, moved the pivot point, and made it smaller overall. I've also solved the problem of the scraping. Just bought some "castle nuts", think that's what they call them. Screw one tightly on the end of the adjusting screw, it has a totally round ball end.....and
"Bob's yer uncle"

After a lot of fiddlin' around with the other type you suggested, and making several versions, the biggest problem was the leverage factor. It was way too hard to pull for a lower and the spring couldn't pull it back. Usually a pull is somewhere around a 3-4 lb. pull. This was a 10 lb. pull to make it lower and return and moving the pivot points etc. didn't seem to help much.....if the pull weight was less then the travel distance was too far... and visa versa.
Anyway, Christmas calls.....so have to leave all this stuff for awhile.
Thanks for your help,
Mac

[Dave-M]

Thanks for the info about your prototypes, Mac. I was about to embark on a two-piece finger on the left and a pull-release one-piece on the right. Now I will reconsider.

Castle nuts is a good idea!

In my design above an auxilliary spring could help pull the raise back to the stop and would also assist the lowers. Did you try a second spring on any of your prototypes?