Inlays

If it has Pedals...
User avatar
sheffield steel
Posts: 188
Joined: Mon May 10, 2010 9:24 am
Location: Southampton, UK

Re: Inlays

Post by sheffield steel »

Slowly getting there, I do hope that you like the photos. Richard, remember you saying about some kinda fancy fret board? well, I'm experimenting with lazer cut paua shell & MoP inlays for the logo & fret board (if it works) I will keep you posted. I just put an old fret board on the D10 to see what she looks like. BTW, that 'aint a line on the front its a shadow.

Dave. :D
Attachments
Mike's D10 8-7-11 014 (2).jpg
Mike's D10 8-7-11 014 (2).jpg (58.98 KiB) Viewed 1682 times
Mike's D10 8-7-11 007 (2).jpg
Mike's D10 8-7-11 007 (2).jpg (29.53 KiB) Viewed 1682 times
Mike's D10 8-7-11 006 - Copy (3).jpg
Mike's D10 8-7-11 006 - Copy (3).jpg (28.38 KiB) Viewed 1682 times
Sheffield D10 9+8, Bradshaw WEBB 614-E, Sheffield stainless steel tone bars, Hilton electronic volume pedal, Pro-Fex 2, BOSS DD3
User avatar
sheffield steel
Posts: 188
Joined: Mon May 10, 2010 9:24 am
Location: Southampton, UK

Re: Inlays

Post by sheffield steel »

The Changer/PuP Housing & Peg Head, you can see the reflection of the tuning pegs & the paua shell on the top deck. A pedal.

Dave. :D
Attachments
Mike's D10 8-7-11 001 (2).jpg
Mike's D10 8-7-11 001 (2).jpg (33.16 KiB) Viewed 1679 times
Mike's D10 8-7-11 003 (2).jpg
Mike's D10 8-7-11 003 (2).jpg (58.5 KiB) Viewed 1681 times
Mike's D10 8-7-11 004 (2).jpg
Mike's D10 8-7-11 004 (2).jpg (63.59 KiB) Viewed 1681 times
Sheffield D10 9+8, Bradshaw WEBB 614-E, Sheffield stainless steel tone bars, Hilton electronic volume pedal, Pro-Fex 2, BOSS DD3
richard37066
Posts: 517
Joined: Sat Dec 11, 2010 11:44 am
Location: Gallatin, Tennessee, USA

Re: Inlays

Post by richard37066 »

Dave -

Gather up all of the superlatives posted above and mentally list them here. Your work and imagination are outstanding.

A couple of things worthy of note - for me, at least:-

A laser cutting technique for MOP and the neck itself (?) opens up a plethora of ideas for tasteful decoration - aside from the garden variety fretboard that most of us are stuck with. Can you give us an idea of the preparation and cost involved? My imagination is now running wild!

Secondly, I note that you used a "split" bellcrank in one of your photos in which additional rods may be fed in order to have a direct pull on the changer finger. This has been my preference from day one. However, the number of adjustment holes in your design are quite limited. In your experience, has this proved to be somewhat detrimental or are they sufficient for the job? I ask this since there seems to be a trend toward a multiplicity of adjustment holes but to what end? As posted elsewhere, if one wants to adjust things such that the start and end points of a couple of pulls are on the money then fine adjustment has merit. However, as Georg once pointed out, if one can't actually HEAR a slight maladjustment then why even bother with added complexity? The Blanton bellcrank comes to mind as I question whether anyone could discern a difference with only a quarter or half-turn of a #10-32 machine screw.

'Preciate it.

Richard
Bent
Posts: 1397
Joined: Mon Nov 02, 2009 3:10 pm
Location: Ontario Canada
Contact:

Re: Inlays

Post by Bent »

FWIW on my current project I have 11 hole bell cranks and that is about 3 too many. I believe 8 holes would be sufficient. Those 8 holes, combined with the tuners and stops is sufficient to get everything timed and tuned.
The Blanton is a different animal in that pedal tuning is done at the bell crank. So there, variable height would be necessary. I still say that the Blanton idea is the best.
http://benrom.com/
21 BenRom pedal steel guitars, a Nash 112 and a 1967 TOS Milling machine with many cutters making one hell of a mess on the floor.
Storm Rosson
Posts: 191
Joined: Sat Jul 10, 2010 8:55 am
Location: Silver City, NM

Re: Inlays

Post by Storm Rosson »

:shock: CURSE YOUR HIDE DAVE !!!....(J/K) ,Dave you are such a master at inlay I'm in awe man ...if I could learn to inlay like that ,it would cure my f'n depression. I say your skill and execution is absolutely second to none.....................................wah!!!!! u gotta show us how do that bro PLEEZ....Stormy :mrgreen:
User avatar
sheffield steel
Posts: 188
Joined: Mon May 10, 2010 9:24 am
Location: Southampton, UK

Re: Inlays

Post by sheffield steel »

Hi Stormy & Richard,
I'm pleased that you all like it, thank you.

I'm still learning and totally self taught. All I do is play around with my dremil and a router attachment for it that my wife bought for me last Christmas, so there is NO real secret. I think (IMHO) that we are only limited by our own imagination.
As for the lazer cutting, Ha, I found a very small company not too far from me that does all this sort of stuff. So I contacted the guy and exchanged a few ideas with him to see what we could come up with for starters (see Sheffield logo). I'm going to meet up with him in 2 weeks to discus a fret board design (very similar to the one that I use) but with paua shell & MoP inlays for the fret lines & marker dot points. The finer points will be wheather I have a separate piece of wood (rose wood, ebony etc) for the fret board or put the inlay into the neck itself, like you said Richard the imagination can run wild, As for the cost? well, the Paua shell & MoP 8"x8" sheets for the logo cost me £40 ($80?) & possibly another £50-£60 ($120) total £100 ($200) for the cutting (estimate) but I don't know the cost for a fret board but hopefully it will be worth it. I've provided the link for the lazer cutting. I do hope that this helps. As for the bell cranks/pull bars, I have 5 holes in them and I've had NO problem balancing things out, that is not to say that there is always room for improvement, it was only the other day that I thought, I can make the pedal design better (than the one in the photo). I would agree with you Bent that we can over complicate things, so keep it simple! BTW lovely tone on blue. Never seen the Blanton, is it similar to the Linkon equaliser?

Best wishes,

Dave. :D

http://www.heritageinlay.com/
Sheffield D10 9+8, Bradshaw WEBB 614-E, Sheffield stainless steel tone bars, Hilton electronic volume pedal, Pro-Fex 2, BOSS DD3
richard37066
Posts: 517
Joined: Sat Dec 11, 2010 11:44 am
Location: Gallatin, Tennessee, USA

Re: Inlays

Post by richard37066 »

Dave -

Here is but one of many references to the Blanton guitar and its' famous bellcrank.

http://www.pedalsteel.co.uk/The-Blanton

Bent is correct when he says that things can be "tuned" at the bellcrank. I, personally, rebel at the idea that I'd have to extricate myself from the instrument in order to snake an arm under the cabinet and locate things by "feel" in order to make an adjustment. I enjoy the egghead view that I have control over all adjustments from the pedal to the changer and can tweak things to my satisfaction. Once set, the nylon adjusters suit me just fine. If I had my "druthers" regarding a bellcrank, I'd probably lean toward the MSA design. A "split" bellcrank with slots - into which a "T"-shaped rod is fitted. Yes, I know, the fabrication of the rod ends might prove to be a small pain but the overall design affords near instant changes.

Some time ago, I posted a reference to a source of paua shell and MOP and who have a rather intricate set of inlays for a pedal steel guitar fretboard. No doubt there would be a degree of "fudging" in order to assemble things accurately but the outcome would be truly elegant.

One wild idea: - Since the thickness of the paua and MOP is in the vicinity of 0.05" (approximately 1.25mm) one could simply mill out the center of the aluminum neck to a depth of 1mm or so while leaving 3-4mm at the edges. Using a space-age epoxy - and in your choice of color - one could place the individual pieces of material in their appropriate places - just "tack" them down. When finished, the spaces between the paua/MOP would be filled in with the epoxy to a height just greater than the outside ridge. This is feasible since these modern epoxies are slow-setting - giving one the time to commit to final placement. Sanding and polishing would then reveal a near-perfect assembly. One caveat - and a possible impediment - is that the epoxy chosen should have a Coefficient of Thermal Expansion as close to the aluminum as is possible so as to reduce the chance for cracking and "checking" as time passes. Does such an animal exist? Don't know since I haven't done the research. It's on my "bucket" list of things to do.

Although the above has a fabrication time significantly less than routing things out by hand I'm mindful of a viable alternative. In my reading, I have found that laser milling can be accomplished, in part, by altering the power in the beam. Is it not then possible to laser mill a wooden neck such that the inlays fit precisely into the cavities? Fabricating a master pattern might prove to be problematical but the end result would be startling! For those of us only wishing to create a "masterpiece" for our personal use, the added expense could, therefore, be justified.

Just tossing a couple of things into the air. Where and how they fall remains to be seen.

Keep us informed as to your progress. You're bringing a level of artistry to the building of the instrument not heretofore seen.

I love it!

Richard
User avatar
sheffield steel
Posts: 188
Joined: Mon May 10, 2010 9:24 am
Location: Southampton, UK

Re: Inlays

Post by sheffield steel »

Hi Richard,

Thank you for the link, its my good friend Bob Adams up there in Bonny Scotland.
Now that I've seen the Blanton, I now understand & what a beautiful tone! I wonder, a Blanton type idea coupled with the standard nylon tuning collars at the end plate, could this take TOTAL BALLANCING to a FINE ART?

Dave :geek:
Last edited by sheffield steel on Tue Jul 12, 2011 11:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
Sheffield D10 9+8, Bradshaw WEBB 614-E, Sheffield stainless steel tone bars, Hilton electronic volume pedal, Pro-Fex 2, BOSS DD3
richard37066
Posts: 517
Joined: Sat Dec 11, 2010 11:44 am
Location: Gallatin, Tennessee, USA

Re: Inlays

Post by richard37066 »

Dave -

You're absolutely right. The only mild "complaint" that I can register is that the Blanton design does not afford the opportunity of multiple pulls in the same plane - that is, additional pulls on the same finger are at an angle to the motion of the finger, itself. This probably does not amount to a hill-o-beans in practice - putting a "Z" in the shape of the rod - but just offends me from a mechanical point of view. Further - and without physical measurements - it would appear that stacking these things side-by-side on the same crossrod would put the pullrods at an angle to the finger - however slight. Yes, I know, recent derivations of the Blanton eliminate this concern but the other fact still remains - the inability to stack a couple of pullrods in exactly the same plane and on the same finger.

Given this, I came up with a bellcrank design which I have not dared to show the members since it requires the machining of a couple of small parts for each rod and I felt that virtually all builders would discard it out of hand as being too complicated and time consuming. My grandiose design also does not afford the adjustability of the Blanton screw-thread but requires an Allen wrench to loosen things up in order to make a sliding adjustment. I can still stack 3 or 4 rods through the "split" in the crank, itself. I occasionally "go back to the drawing board" in persuing this since the Blanton, in itself, is a great idea. Maybe someday.

Richard
Bent
Posts: 1397
Joined: Mon Nov 02, 2009 3:10 pm
Location: Ontario Canada
Contact:

Re: Inlays

Post by Bent »

Dave wrote: Now that I've seen the Blanton, I now understand & what a beautiful tone! I wonder, a Blanton type idea coupled with the standard nylon tuning collars at the end plate, could this take TOTAL BALLANCING to a FINE ART?
Dave, my thoughts exactly! I have thought this for some time and have come to the conclusion that this is really it. Even with 8 hole bell cranks, there comes a time where you will have to leave just a wee bit to much slop at the nylon tuner in order to achieve the exact right timing. I am at this point now with "Blue"
I am totally in awe how nice and easy this changer pulls. But on the 3rd and 6th strings raise (ped B), the 3rd starts raising just a hair sooner than the 6th. No big deal cause the changer is so nice that I can't feel this underfoot. I just know it's there and really shouldn't be.

Enough of that... I had the rare opportunity to speak with Jerry Blanton on a couple of occasions - a fine and down to earth man as you'd want. He readily admits that the drawback of his bell crank is that you can't have rods passing through the crank. This might result in extra bends on the rods when doing the routing upon setup. Jerry's bell cranks are by necessity, thick. This prevents another rod passing beside a bell crank so a bend has to be made.

Someone had ideas on here on how to expand on Jerry's idea, on how to make the bell crank more versatile and useable. Was it Mac? Or Eldon?

Yes! Isn't the tone wonderful in the Blanton? The main difference from it and other steels is the weight and density of the materials. It was not made with portability in mind. I believe he told me a double neck 10 string weighs 90 Lbs in the case. Steel frame plus solid castings for keyhead, end plates etc.

I challenge every body with an inventive mind to come up with a skinnier Blanton type bell crank OR some way to let rods pass through. I believe since the string spacing most widely used is 11/32", you restrict the width of your crank to less than that.
Jerry told me he doesn't care if we copy him. That's just the kind of guy he is :-)
BlantCrnk.jpg
BlantCrnk.jpg (9.61 KiB) Viewed 1621 times
http://benrom.com/
21 BenRom pedal steel guitars, a Nash 112 and a 1967 TOS Milling machine with many cutters making one hell of a mess on the floor.
Post Reply