newbe

[Allan]

In case anyone still isn't clear on this I did a quick sketch. It's important to get this right to avoid disappointment later. I got it wrong on the first guitar I ever made and wasn't able to put it right because of the head design.

The first pic shows the string pulling the worm and the capstan gear together.

rightway.jpg (18.36 KiB) Viewed 1629 times

This is the right way to do it. The worm gear is part of the system that resists the string so that it can come to tension.

The second pic shows what happens if the worm gear is not there to resist the string.

wrongway.jpg (19.13 KiB) Viewed 1629 times

The capstan pulls out of position and eventually the capstan gear looses contact with the worm and the complete system fails.

I am aware that, in the case of modern, covered machines, there is less chance of this happening in the short term but it will happen eventually and, as it does, the tuner becomes harder and harder to use as the gears jam together. It just makes sense to get it right.

Hope that makes it clear. The sketches were done in a hurry.

Regards, Allan.....

[Pat Comeau]

[Allan]

Pat, look at the first drawing that Jim posted and you will see that the tuner knob is on the body side of the string capstan.
Since you mentioned a Les Paul in your previous post here is one to consider. As you will see, it is done right.

LPtunerfront.jpeg (3.34 KiB) Viewed 1625 times

LPtuner.jpeg (3.55 KiB) Viewed 1625 times

Compare that with Jim's first pic and you will see what I noticed.

Allan.....

[jgrant42]

very good lesson won't make that mistake again

[jgrant42]

got it really common sense after allan put the drawing on site. will not forget that one
Have to take it apart to finish so will change them then. Have to put a bar or something on tuning mashine side of bridge to hold string down onto bridge a little , any ideas. I am sure I will come up with something but maybe someone has an idea.
thanks
jim

[Allan]

...Have to put a bar or something on tuning mashine side of bridge to hold string down onto bridge a little...
jim

Really? It looks good Jim. It's surprising to see you say that. Is it possible that you can post a pic from the side?

Allan.....

[jgrant42]

allan got your message been busy will try to get pic out today
jim

[jgrant42]

allan here are a few pics

[Allan]

Ah, now I see what you mean. That's not the bridge Jim. That's referred to as the nut.

OK, if you find that the strings are moving across the nut I would start by carefully cutting notches for the strings to ride in. You may need to do that anyhow to make the tops of the strings level so as to avoid buzzing when you bring the bar to the machine head end of the guitar. When you make those slots in the nut don't use your bar to line up the string tops - use a steel rule or anything else that is light in weight. If you use a heavy bar you will be displacing the strings and distorting the tuning so that you will never get a good level action.
If you can't make the strings stable with that then yeppers, you will need to add a hold down. The problem here is that the force applied when you do this is upwards and tends to pull the screw out. For that reason the best type is usually what Fender call a 'string tree' - look at StewMac's for those. You may need two, but usually, one is enough - on the middle two strings.
Is the nut its self fixed down? If not, you should start with that. To avoid side to side movement you can just use loose dowels. you can make those with a simple length of metal from a nail or anything else. You just drill in to the metal nut (not right through) and into the wood below (again, just part way). Then, reassemble with the dowels in place and that will hold the nut in place laterally.

And now - OK, what's that guitar sitting on for the pics? Is it a Fender console?

Hope this helps, but if not, keep asking - loads of good guys here to help.

Regards, Allan.....

[jgrant42]

Thanks Allan
I knew that was the nut just misspoke I am learning slow but sure. Do you mean fasten the nut to the wood it sits in because the bridge is nut held in either. When I take it apart to finish it I am thinking about makingbridge and nut out of deer horns, what is your input on that.
The bottom guitar is a 1950's gibson electraharp 8 string, picked that one and a old harlin bros 6 string at a sale
Thanks for your help
JIM