question

[Leon Campbell]

I wanted to know what is the best way to cut the sheet metal parts for the changer fingers? Thank you very much, Leon

[Bent]

Leon, no matter what you use, this part of the building is a pain in the a$$ at best. After I got the mill, I gang up 10 in a jig and cut them with limited success.
Before the mill, I tried: Using my dremel tool with a cutting disk. Clearly not the best solution. I have tried using a metal cutting blade on the band saw. This works fine until I wear out that $40 blade way too soon. I cut them out rough and then I grind them rough on the bench grinder, then I finish them on my 1" wide belt sander. To get into wee corners I use files and various tools on the dremel. Even with the mill, they are a royal pain. I hope others have brighter ideas than mine. Let's hear them!

[Leon Campbell]

Thanks Bent, I hope others will join in, I need all the help I can get. Do you thank hand nibblers will worh or elec. shears? Thanks, Leon

[Bent]

Yes, I would go for hand nibblers. They would be of help.

[richard37066]

Bent -

Here's the old man with another coccamamy idea.

Since you are now in the business of building for sale - and - since you have that TOS miller at your disposal, could you turn out a tool and die set, harden the bejabbers out of it and then use a suitable bench press to stamp out the parts?

Tol ya it would be off-the-wall! Teach me!

Richard

[Bent]

Richard, that's the best so far! Keep that thinking cap on. The way I see it is to make several stamps (dies?). Visualize:The lowering finger which is that most intricate. Make a die for one side and then the other maybe? The holes could be pre-drilled maybe? I believe it would be beyond my ability to make a whole die and get it accurate enough for my liking. What do you think? One would need a solid press to stamp out these things. They are 16 ga stainless and harder than japanese arithmetic

[richard37066]

Bent -

Love your reply. Japanese arithmetic, eh?

The closest that I've come to seeing someone make such a gadget is when a friend of mine made a broach for squaring the corners in a round hole or a milled slot. You can tell that I know nothing about the actual fabrication of a tool/die set.

Are you familiar with Greenlee punches? They'll put holes in sheet metal with the turning of a large screw in the middle. IF - IF - it would take a machine as big as your TOS to punch out the fingers in stainless, then could you make a die set instead with 2 or 4 holes and using Grade 8 bolts to draw the things together? At first glance, it seems to require a bit of labor, but I imagine that cutting those things essentially by hand is VERY labor intensive. IN practice, you'd give each bolt a quarter turn, much like tightening the head bolts on an old flat-head V8 car engine. I don't have the foggiest as to the clearance necessary between the tool and die. The guy that gave you the TOS could probably give you a good number off the top of his head. Pick his brains for all that they're worth.

And, yes, I would imagine that you'd want to bore the holes first in a larger piece of material. Locating pins - or some means of registration would be necessary - but it would be a lot easier than trying to hold a funky-shaped piece in a drill press after it was finished.

If you're comfortable with the finger design - and in the long term - then would it be worth the investment in some time and a little money in order to streamline the overall operation?

Don't really know, my friend. Just trying to get your thought processes to churning in an effort to come up with a better - and, hopefully - easier way to do something.

You now know my favorite phrase in regards your PSG building.

"Go Gettum!"

Richard

[Bent]

Leon, I hope we are not drifting away from your original question, just let us know if you would, please.

Bent -

Love your reply. Japanese arithmetic, eh?

The guy that gave you the TOS could probably give you a good number off the top of his head. Pick his brains for all that they're worth.

If you're comfortable with the finger design - and in the long term - then would it be worth the investment in some time and a little money in order to streamline the overall operation?


Richard

Richard, I love play on words. I gather this useless stuff. Kinda puts a smile on my face
Darn right I will run this by George. I pick his brains every time we talk. He is a teacher and machinist and engineer. There is nothing that George doesn't know or at least has an opinion on!
I visualize an arbor press (?) where you have a handle that is geared and makes you very strong. I believe Pat Comeau has one...Pat?
But that would be like stamping wouldn't it? And then you would need both a male and a female die would you not? And you'd have to stamp out the whole part, not like I said earlier two halves.
I know it would be worth the time and investment. It's doable too, long as I get some guidance.
So that was suggestion #1. Keep'em coming guys!
Thanks again Richard.

[richard37066]

Bent -

You're right of course. My dumb idea would require wide tolerances in order to accomodate the "cocking" of the tool as it is forced into the die even with fine thread bolts to do the job. I didn't mention the arbor press since that is what I thought everyone was thinking. Your friend would most likely know if you can achieve enough pressure to stamp that stainless. Yes, also, to the notion that you'd need two such sets in order to get the job done. If it's feasible then your friend can probably give you an idea of how many stampings you can get out of the die set before it becomes useless. If you set a dollar value on your time then you can easily calculate whether the cost of the tool/die set and arbor press will be worth it. Were it me, I'd probably lean in favor of the ease with which those parts could be made even if there is no cost benefit. You can well imagine spending a day or two cranking out enough fingers for a dozen or so guitars and putting them in a "parts bin" for use as needed. This is not a new concept as you well know. I've seen photos of Gene Fields' stockpile of die-board pieces that appear to be sufficient for a whole bunch of guitars. Maybe you could apportion your time - temporarily - between actual building and making parts for various "stockpiles". Yeh, I know, it's a bummer of a decision but in the long run it does have its' advantages. Maybe it's also a decision based upon how comfortable YOU feel in formulating a slightly different building process.

As I said, pick his brains for all that they're worth and then you'll be able to make the decision as to whether it will all be worth it. Just trying to stimulate your thinking.

How 'bout a hundred thousand dollar laser cutter? Uh - maybe not.

Guess that was not very stimulating.

Richard

[Bent]

Richard, to cut along story short, for now I'll just say a big YES to everything you suggested and keep this chat in mind for future retrieval.
Yeah I better not mention the laser cutter to George or he'll most certainly come up with something else to tempt me with! I guess I am in line for a DRO as well. Nice to have friends like George
By the way he is making up a template for me - one to lay over the deck, for drilling all the holes needed in the wood. With hardened bushings with the right size holes in them to take millions of drillings without deforming. This is just the way George is...a very interesting and knowledgeable man with a heart of gold.